Superman Reboot (Man of Steel)

[Dangelus]

'It's a reboot they can do what they like."

This is what you all tell me when I criticise Star Trek.

I feel STAR TREK is absolutley a reboot in terms of how I consume the new stuff. This film I had no real dog in the fight, so reboot or slavish recreation didn't matter to me as I am not very invested in the source material like I am with Trek.

Exactly. Its double standards. Because this isn't one of your precious franchises you find it acceptable to question creative decisions but shoot down or dismiss others who do the same to other properties. I'm not trying to be offensive here but that's how it's coming across a bit.

For sure, but that in and of itself is the very definition of fandom. I have no problem with people not liking the new STAR TREK films, but I will debate with greater vigor those criticisms more then I will for a franchise like Superman. My review was postive but I had some issues. Same with Into Darkness, I felt the whole Admiral Marcus part was ill conceiveds and executed and Khan was too under utilized.

Well you know I'm going to disagree with your interpretation of fandom and how your rules of conduct vary between discussing franchises so I'll leave it. Lol

[Bryancd]

Note to self...find the Rule of Conduct Book... ;)

[Bryancd]

One other question regarding the Fortress of Solitude...

[spoiler]Or in this case the 20,000 year old ship. How would it be possible for a El family suit be in the ship ready for Kal-el?[/spoiler]

Good point.. I never questioned that.

[spoiler]Maybe when Jor El was downloaded to the ship a schismatic of the suit was also download and the ship created it.. I wouldn't put it past their level of technology. [/spoiler]

That's kind of what I figured as well Kenny. One thing about Zod that I changed my mind about post seeing the film...
[spoiler]I spent most of the movie not finding him to be a little shrill but the moment where he discusses how he was made to defend his people, I actually felt a lot of sympathy towrds him.[/spoiler]

[Geekyfanboy]

One other question regarding the Fortress of Solitude...

[spoiler]Or in this case the 20,000 year old ship. How would it be possible for a El family suit be in the ship ready for Kal-el?[/spoiler]

Good point.. I never questioned that.

[spoiler]Maybe when Jor El was downloaded to the ship a schismatic of the suit was also download and the ship created it.. I wouldn't put it past their level of technology. [/spoiler]

That's kind of what I figured as well Kenny. One thing about Zod that I changed my mind about post seeing the film...
[spoiler]I spent most of the movie not finding him to be a little shrill but the moment where he discusses how he was made to defend his people, I actually felt a lot of sympathy towrds him.[/spoiler]

Yep same with me Bryan.. I even went one step further.

[spoiler]I didn't see Zod as a "bad" guy. He was created to preserve his race and that's what he was doing, unfortunately it was at the cost of the human race. I think he became the "bad guy" at the point when he realized that there was no chance of saving his race and he was going to destroy what Superman holds dear to him... the human race.[/spoiler]

[Bryancd]

One other question regarding the Fortress of Solitude...

[spoiler]Or in this case the 20,000 year old ship. How would it be possible for a El family suit be in the ship ready for Kal-el?[/spoiler]

Good point.. I never questioned that.

[spoiler]Maybe when Jor El was downloaded to the ship a schismatic of the suit was also download and the ship created it.. I wouldn't put it past their level of technology. [/spoiler]

That's kind of what I figured as well Kenny. One thing about Zod that I changed my mind about post seeing the film...
[spoiler]I spent most of the movie not finding him to be a little shrill but the moment where he discusses how he was made to defend his people, I actually felt a lot of sympathy towrds him.[/spoiler]

Yep same with me Bryan.. I even went one step further.

[spoiler]I didn't see Zod as a "bad" guy. He was created to preserve his race and that's what he was doing, unfortunately it was at the cost of the human race. I think he became the "bad guy" at the point when he realized that there was no chance of saving his race and he was going to destroy what Superman holds dear to him... the human race.[/spoiler]

Yeah, and he seemed to have a sense of regret over that, almot resigned to his role in the universe.

[Dangelus]

Note to self...find the Rule of Conduct Book... ;)

It's filled under "conscience" :-)

[Bryancd]

Internet chat forums, let's not put too fine a point in it...

[Meds]

I still have not seen this yet and will be going next week. Looking forward to reading all these thoughts and comments and spoiler tags.

[Dangelus]

Internet chat forums, let's not put too fine a point in it...

I deal with people I talk to online as honestly and consistently as those I deal with face to face.

I still have not seen this yet and will be going next week. Looking forward to reading all these thoughts and comments and spoiler tags.

I've read some interesting changes that I'm not sure I'm to thrilled about but I'm looking forward to it.

[Bryancd]

I deal with people I talk to online as honestly and consistently as those I deal with face to face.

Now Dan, after all this time would you seriously consider me to be any different? Often to the consternation of those around me, if I am anything, it's consistent. :)

And it is off topic but the implication that to be biased towards something you hold dear vs. that which you don't is not poor form, it's simply a reflection of what you are passionate about, your veiled hint at hypocrisy not withstanding.

[ChrisMC]

Can't wait 'till Star Wars 7 comes out...THINGS GON' HEAT UP 'ROUND HERE!

[Dangelus]

I deal with people I talk to online as honestly and consistently as those I deal with face to face.

Now Dan, after all this time would you seriously consider me to be any different? Often to the consternation of those around me, if I am anything, it's consistent. :)

And it is off topic but the implication that to be biased towards something you hold dear vs. that which you don't is not poor form, it's simply a reflection of what you are passionate about, your veiled hint at hypocrisy not withstanding.

Bias is fine, we all have a bias but to reject discussion or criticism of one property when it suits you then make the same arguments yourself just isn't cricket...

[Dangelus]

Can't wait 'till Star Wars 7 comes out...THINGS GON' HEAT UP 'ROUND HERE!

SW7 is going to be great. It'll keep JJ away from Star Trek! :-)

[Bryancd]

Bias is fine, we all have a bias but to reject discussion or criticism of one property when it suits you then make the same arguments yourself just isn't cricket...

I have no idea where this is coming from, Dan. I thought we were just discussing this film, you seem to be bringing a lot of extra baggage on board. Who do you feel is rejecting discussion or criticism?

[Dangelus]

Bias is fine, we all have a bias but to reject discussion or criticism of one property when it suits you then make the same arguments yourself just isn't cricket...

I have no idea where this is coming from, Dan. I thought we were just discussing this film, you seem to be bringing a lot of extra baggage on board. Who do you feel is rejecting discussion or criticism?

Don't want to off topic this thread too much but...

I just feel it should be a level playing field no matter which franchise an individual is trying to discuss. You've admitted yourself you change the rules depending whether you are invested in the subject or not. In this thread you query a plot hole inviting discussion which is great but Star Trek plot hole discussion is played down.