Osama bin Laden is dead...

Started by Bryancd, May 01, 2011, 07:57:38 PM

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billybob476

What? I don't merit the SAS? Bin Laden got Seal Team 6!

Feathers

Quote from: billybob476 on May 05, 2011, 01:56:22 PM
What? I don't merit the SAS? Bin Laden got Seal Team 6!

Sorry, got to protect the public purse. Can't afford the bullets. You know how it is with a Tory government. ;)

I know it's unnusual here but I don't have a podcast of my own.

Blackride

#77
Quote from: X on May 05, 2011, 12:46:35 PM
Quote from: Blackride on May 05, 2011, 04:05:28 AM
I don't like the celebrations that happened
psonally. Celebrating anyone's death goes against my beliefs. At the same time I have not problem with the actions take by our govt.. Bin Laden was not a citizen and is not protected by our Constitution. I think brining him in and putting him on trial would be a mess and would put our citizens in a dangerous position.
Well, I'm glad that you don't have a law degree. Even non-citizens are protected by the constitution. That's something that was supposed to be taught in junior high.

Also, there are laws that prevent us from assassinating people, which is why they could only kill him if he posed a clear and present danger.

Do me a favor and don't comment on the constitution if you don't know what you're talking about. It really makes us look bad when things like that hit the web with no support. It probably looks worse for the person saying it when they have to be corrected.

First off I have respect for others even if they are on message boards. I will not address you the way you address me. The international community wants the US citizens to show respect so it starts at home.  

All I ask is that even though this is a message board and people seem to like to talk "big", that they treat each other with respect. Everyone makes mistakes! This is a forum where people discuss and your was not a discussion it was something else.

BTW I did go to an inner-city school where we carried guns to school and worried about living not about the exact points of the Constitution. I am proud of going to College and changing my life. Clearly we come from different areas......
Ripley: Ash. Any suggestions from you or Mother?
Ash: No, we're still collating.
Ripley: [Laughing in disbelief] You're what? You're still collating? I find that hard to believe.

X

Quote from: Blackride on May 05, 2011, 02:42:38 PM
Quote from: X on May 05, 2011, 12:46:35 PM
Quote from: Blackride on May 05, 2011, 04:05:28 AM
I don't like the celebrations that happened
psonally. Celebrating anyone's death goes against my beliefs. At the same time I have not problem with the actions take by our govt.. Bin Laden was not a citizen and is not protected by our Constitution. I think brining him in and putting him on trial would be a mess and would put our citizens in a dangerous position.
Well, I'm glad that you don't have a law degree. Even non-citizens are protected by the constitution. That's something that was supposed to be taught in junior high.

Also, there are laws that prevent us from assassinating people, which is why they could only kill him if he posed a clear and present danger.

Do me a favor and don't comment on the constitution if you don't know what you're talking about. It really makes us look bad when things like that hit the web with no support. It probably looks worse for the person saying it when they have to be corrected.

First off I have respect for others even if they are on message boards. I will not address you the way you address me. The international community wants the US citizens to show respect so it starts at home. 

All I ask is that even though this is a message board and people seem to like to talk "big", that they treat each other with respect. Everyone makes mistakes! This is a forum where people discuss and your was not a discussion it was something else.

BTW I did go to an inner-city school where we carried guns to school and worried about living not about the exact points of the Constitution. I am proud of going to College and changing my life. Clearly we come from different areas......
Look, I wasn't trying to make you feel attacked, but when you make comments about a legal system that, as someone living in it, we should know something about, it should be backed up with facts. I think that's one of my journalism pet peeves that's a hold over from school.

We actually don't come from that different a place, but that's not the point. As the saying goes: "Ignorance is not an excuse.". My asking you not to comment if you didn't know wasn't me being cynical, it was me trying to ask you to be aware of what you're saying. Like it or not, true or not, people outside of our country actually expect us to know a little about our country. When we make these comments, they actually come off as believable because people not here assume that we should know what we're talking about because we're actually living here.

As for mine not being a discussion, I believe that it was. You made a statement that was wrong either through intention or ignorance and people not from here assumed that you knew what you were talking about. Perhaps I could have said it a little nicer, but I'm really sick of having to explain to people outside of the country that we're not the war loving cowboys that tend to ignore the rule of law.

I also highly respect and agree with your views on not celebrating the death of Bin Laden. I wasn't trying to pick on you, but I guess I had hit my limit on politely trying to repair the damage that others do to the outside view of our country.

What you said amounted to "If you're not a US citizen, we can kill you with no problem, we can beat you, torture, and rape you too because you have no rights here or anywhere near us, even when we're in your country."

I have a fundamental problem with that image of us being spread.

Sorry if I was too harsh in my reply.

Blackride

Quote from: X on May 05, 2011, 04:10:39 PM
Quote from: Blackride on May 05, 2011, 02:42:38 PM
Quote from: X on May 05, 2011, 12:46:35 PM
Quote from: Blackride on May 05, 2011, 04:05:28 AM
I don't like the celebrations that happened
psonally. Celebrating anyone's death goes against my beliefs. At the same time I have not problem with the actions take by our govt.. Bin Laden was not a citizen and is not protected by our Constitution. I think brining him in and putting him on trial would be a mess and would put our citizens in a dangerous position.
Well, I'm glad that you don't have a law degree. Even non-citizens are protected by the constitution. That's something that was supposed to be taught in junior high.

Also, there are laws that prevent us from assassinating people, which is why they could only kill him if he posed a clear and present danger.

Do me a favor and don't comment on the constitution if you don't know what you're talking about. It really makes us look bad when things like that hit the web with no support. It probably looks worse for the person saying it when they have to be corrected.

First off I have respect for others even if they are on message boards. I will not address you the way you address me. The international community wants the US citizens to show respect so it starts at home. 

All I ask is that even though this is a message board and people seem to like to talk "big", that they treat each other with respect. Everyone makes mistakes! This is a forum where people discuss and your was not a discussion it was something else.

BTW I did go to an inner-city school where we carried guns to school and worried about living not about the exact points of the Constitution. I am proud of going to College and changing my life. Clearly we come from different areas......
Look, I wasn't trying to make you feel attacked, but when you make comments about a legal system that, as someone living in it, we should know something about, it should be backed up with facts. I think that's one of my journalism pet peeves that's a hold over from school.

We actually don't come from that different a place, but that's not the point. As the saying goes: "Ignorance is not an excuse.". My asking you not to comment if you didn't know wasn't me being cynical, it was me trying to ask you to be aware of what you're saying. Like it or not, true or not, people outside of our country actually expect us to know a little about our country. When we make these comments, they actually come off as believable because people not here assume that we should know what we're talking about because we're actually living here.

As for mine not being a discussion, I believe that it was. You made a statement that was wrong either through intention or ignorance and people not from here assumed that you knew what you were talking about. Perhaps I could have said it a little nicer, but I'm really sick of having to explain to people outside of the country that we're not the war loving cowboys that tend to ignore the rule of law.

I also highly respect and agree with your views on not celebrating the death of Bin Laden. I wasn't trying to pick on you, but I guess I had hit my limit on politely trying to repair the damage that others do to the outside view of our country.

What you said amounted to "If you're not a US citizen, we can kill you with no problem, we can beat you, torture, and rape you too because you have no rights here or anywhere near us, even when we're in your country."

I have a fundamental problem with that image of us being spread.

Sorry if I was too harsh in my reply.

Thanks for the reply x. I respect someone that can reply to me the way you did and apologize. Takes a big person to do that.
Ripley: Ash. Any suggestions from you or Mother?
Ash: No, we're still collating.
Ripley: [Laughing in disbelief] You're what? You're still collating? I find that hard to believe.

Meds

#80
Chris hates everyone outside of the US. ;) Runs away quickly ;)

X

Quote from: HawkeyeMeds on May 05, 2011, 04:18:53 PM
Chris hates everyone outside of the US. ;) Runs away quickly ;)
Which one? both of us are chrises.

Meds

LOL well that boosted the joke ;) 

Back to the main topic, I'm a little bit shocked now at the sudden different stpries of events. We go from a shoot out with his wife being used as a shield to no shoot out and his wife being shot in the leg. That doesnt look good, PR should be shot (wrong phrase PR should be sacked) for that blunder. The photo shown on the news (sky) was a fake (another case of shitty journalism).

The main question now is Pakistans security issues. I'm not going to say they knew he was there (though it seems likely someone knew). Also the UK has gone on high security alert, our chief police constable has issed a statement saying a it is likely we will see some sort of attack in reprisal. This does not suprise me, in fact i expected it which is why i said in the earlier part of this thread i will not celebrate when i know more innocent people will die because of this.

Bryancd

Quote from: Blackride on May 05, 2011, 02:42:38 PM
All I ask is that even though this is a message board and people seem to like to talk "big", that they treat each other with respect.

Actually, it has been proven that I am a complete bastard. There apparently was a study done. Carry on...

Bryancd

Honestly, I think the criticism being levied against the Administration and Obama regarding the killing of Obama are unfair. George Bush declared war against Al Queda, this was an act of war as per that US doctrine. The operation was appropriate. How we feel about it is up for friendly debate.

KingIsaacLinksr

Quote from: Bryancd on May 05, 2011, 05:05:56 PM
Quote from: Blackride on May 05, 2011, 02:42:38 PM
All I ask is that even though this is a message board and people seem to like to talk "big", that they treat each other with respect.

Actually, it has been proven that I am a complete bastard. There apparently was a study done. Carry on...

Really?  Dang.  *starts stepping away from Bryan*

King
A Paladin Without A Crusade Blog... www.kingisaaclinksr.wordpress.com
My Review of Treks In Sci-Fi Podcast: http://wp.me/pQq2J-zs
Let's Play: Videogames YouTube channel: www.youtube.com/kingisaaclinksr

X

Quote from: Bryancd on May 05, 2011, 05:05:56 PM
Quote from: Blackride on May 05, 2011, 02:42:38 PM
All I ask is that even though this is a message board and people seem to like to talk "big", that they treat each other with respect.

Actually, it has been proven that I am a complete bastard. There apparently was a study done. Carry on...
I think I had that same study done on me ... my mother described me as a heartless bastard, but said it was a compliment.

Feathers

#87
Quote from: Bryancd on May 05, 2011, 05:39:27 PM
Honestly, I think the criticism being levied against the Administration and Obama regarding the killing of Obama are unfair. George Bush declared war against Al Queda, this was an act of war as per that US doctrine. The operation was appropriate. How we feel about it is up for friendly debate.

Can you legally declare war on something other than a nation state? How does that work? If it doesn't then all you can do is extradite a criminal for a crime for trial and conviction. (I understand the rhetoric of the 'war on terror' but that is surely very different from an actual, 'legal' shooting war).

The other potential issue is that you haven't declared war on Pakistan (yet). I think we're all lucky that the Pakistani's didn't shoot down one of the helicopters invading their airspace.

I know it's unnusual here but I don't have a podcast of my own.

Meds

@Bryan, @Chris I'd say you're both rather charming bastards ;)

Bromptonboy

I am fascinated by the helicopters used by the SEAL teams.  There was a program for a stealth chopper that was canceled some time ago - I guess that it was somehow kept alive.  Makes me wonder what other tech goodies are out there that we don't know about. 
Pete