iPhone 4G?

[Rico]

Umm, so buying a phone isn't for the phone part?  Then why buy it and not just a netbook or iPad or iPod touch?  Sorry, a cell phone for me still has to be a very good phone first and foremost. 

[Bryancd]

Umm, so buying a phone isn't for the phone part?  Then why buy it and not just a netbook or iPad or iPod touch?  Sorry, a cell phone for me still has to be a very good phone first and foremost. 

No, I understand your point, but these kind of trends are what's important to keep in mind when evaluating the potential of a product. It might not work foe you..or me... but we all need to look beyond our own prejudices to see the bigger picture. Honestly, I don't come on here to "defend" Apple. I don't work for them and have no dog in the fight beyond the stock price and an appreciation for what the company does. What I do challenge in all the Apple product threads are the naysayers who are convinced the latest product for them is doomed to failure or that somebody else will do it better. Not yet, the iPad being the latest example. May not work for some around here but it's a MASSIVE success. We just need to see the forest despite the tree's.

[KingIsaacLinksr]

With skype getting more powerful and prevalent, phone companies need to step it up. Also, hulu+ is a major threat to cable companies. In other words

ADAPT or die you lazy companies.

[Rico]

Umm, so buying a phone isn't for the phone part?  Then why buy it and not just a netbook or iPad or iPod touch?  Sorry, a cell phone for me still has to be a very good phone first and foremost. 

No, I understand your point, but these kind of trends are what's important to keep in mind when evaluating the potential of a product. It might not work foe you..or me... but we all need to look beyond our own prejudices to see the bigger picture. Honestly, I don't come on here to "defend" Apple. I don't work for them and have no dog in the fight beyond the stock price and an appreciation for what the company does. What I do challenge in all the Apple product threads are the naysayers who are convinced the latest product for them is doomed to failure or that somebody else will do it better. Not yet, the iPad being the latest example. May not work for some around here but it's a MASSIVE success. We just need to see the forest despite the tree's.

I don't have any prejudices.  I don't care if Apple conquers the planet or falls off into the abyss.  None of that matters to me.  All that matters to me is getting a good product for my hard earned money.  I spend a HUGE amount of time reading and researching things before I buy anything.  I spent months looking for a new car, reading everything, driving tons of things.  I buy what I feel works best for me and is a solid product.  But, when something does have issues I will let people know.  I do this for everything - not just Apple products.  If you want to start a car thread I have a ton of info and thoughts on the current state of what is out there too.  Anyway, like Joe Friday used to say on "Dragnet" - "Just the facts ma'am."  ;)

[X]

With skype getting more powerful and prevalent, phone companies need to step it up. Also, hulu+ is a major threat to cable companies. In other words

ADAPT or die you lazy companies.

Hulu+ is a joke. Ten bucks a month for network tv that you can tivo for free? No thank you. You can also get basic cable for twice that with WAY more programming. Hulu+ is a threat to cable companies in the way that a mosquito is a threat to a battleship.

[X]

Also, one last thing to consider King ... to use Skype, you need broadband ... you are going to have to get that from your cable company or your phone company. The last time I checked, High Speed internet is WAY more expensive than a regular phone line.

They have already adapted and conquered. Their phone packages are also pretty cheep on both sides.

The added benefit is that you can call anyone with a phone and don't need to be bound to one brand of software.

[Bryancd]

Rico, didn't you buy a Zune, an HD-DVD player, and a Pontiac??  ;)

My point is you can do all the research and be well considered and still bet on the wrong horse, where the platform disappears and you are left out. Anticipating trends is an important as analyzing technology. And when I say prejudices, you're thinking too small. We are all biased towards things and concepts and ideals, not just brand and products, and it influences our thinking. I'm not saying anyone is wrong, I simply saying there's data to suggest smart phone use is less about the phone then some may think. Worth considering.

[X]

Rico, didn't you buy a Zune, an HD-DVD player, and a Pontiac??  ;)

My point is you can do all the research and be well considered and still bet on the wrong horse, where the platform disappears and you are left out. Anticipating trends is an important as analyzing technology. And when I say prejudices, you're thinking too small. We are all biased towards things and concepts and ideals, not just brand and products, and it influences our thinking. I'm not saying anyone is wrong, I simply saying there's data to suggest smart phone use is less about the phone then some may think. Worth considering.

Just because something succeeds doesn't mean it's a better product. Beta-max was better than VHS, but when the porn industry got behind vhs, it killed the beta-max. HD-DVD is in many ways superior to Bluray. Features that were standard with Hd-dvd is just making it to bluray. Bluray won, not because it was better, but because it was created by a major studio that wouldn't release on the other format. They had a vested interest in the success because they make money on the movies and the devices.

Zune, while originally hideous, offered far better features than the iPOD and still does. I think the iPOD is a great device, but it's not the best out there.

I don't think it has anything at all to do with being biased. It has to do with not blindly following the pack and doing the research on a particular device.

I believe that Smart phones aren't used as phones as much as other phones, but you have to ask the question why.

Are people using smart phones as phones less because of they don't care about the phone part or because they have come to accept that the phone part is below par? If it is the first part, why is there not a product like a 3G iPOD touch? I'm pretty sure that not everyone that wants just the apps wants to carry around the iPAD.

BTW if they create a 3G touch, it was my idea and I want royalties.

[KingIsaacLinksr]

BTW if they create a 3G touch, it was my idea and I want royalties.

lulz.  Actually, if they just added a friggin camera like the iPod Nano got (except with PICTURE AND FLASH), I would be more than happy to not get an iPhone, just the next gen iPod touch.  No connection to AT&T, no stupid Bandwidth charges and all the apps I could ever hope for.  

Then I'd just get a crappy phone for my phone.  

And I do agree with the above statements, Hulu+ and Skype are not threats...yet.  But let's face facts here.  Because of how popular Facebook and Twitter are, I am now either going to totally remove texting or do 200 texts paid for or w/e when I renew my contract with Verizon.  Unlimited texting is a wasted feature to me as I just..never text. 

So technology is starting to catch up to these major powerhouses and Skype, Hulu+ and Netflix? are possible threats. 

King

[Bryancd]

Just because something succeeds doesn't mean it's a better product. Beta-max was better than VHS, but when the porn industry got behind vhs, it killed the beta-max. HD-DVD is in many ways superior to Bluray. Features that were standard with Hd-dvd is just making it to bluray. Bluray won, not because it was better, but because it was created by a major studio that wouldn't release on the other format. They had a vested interest in the success because they make money on the movies and the devices.

Zune, while originally hideous, offered far better features than the iPOD and still does. I think the iPOD is a great device, but it's not the best out there.

I don't think it has anything at all to do with being biased. It has to do with not blindly following the pack and doing the research on a particular device.

I believe that Smart phones aren't used as phones as much as other phones, but you have to ask the question why.

Are people using smart phones as phones less because of they don't care about the phone part or because they have come to accept that the phone part is below par? If it is the first part, why is there not a product like a 3G iPOD touch? I'm pretty sure that not everyone that wants just the apps wants to carry around the iPAD.

BTW if they create a 3G touch, it was my idea and I want royalties.

All true, but at the end of the day if the platform doesn't suceed, you're kind of stuck. What's "the best" in technology is subjective to the end user. Apple has created a felf fulfilling eco-system that will make it very difficult for another platform to break.

In regards to phone usage, my brother and sister text more than thye  talk on their phones by far. My wife's friend who is in her late 20's told me once that guy's now ask girls out on dates via texting. It seems people don't even talk anymore! Not idle speculation on my part, this is what's happening, this is what Piper Jaffrey quanitified int heir analysis. It has nothing to do with call quality.

[Feathers]

Derailing us back onto the iPhone 4 for a moment ;) I think one of the other 'issues' around this problem is that it's something that depends on the individual. Saying that 'not everyone experiences the problem' is different from saying that the problem isn't present in every phone.

There certainly is the local signal strength to take into consideration but also the conductivity of the skin of the person holding the phone. Stick a bit of tin foil over the gap, grip it tightly and then see how many phones have a problem.

I'm not bashing the phone, I'm so close to ordering one it's not true, but I think Apple have been caught out here and aren't covering themselves in glory in the way they're trying to defend themselves.

The software fix is rubbish (it has to be!) but I don't think the full extent of the problem has been revealed either.

[Rico]

Rico, didn't you buy a Zune, an HD-DVD player, and a Pontiac??  ;)

Yep to all.  The Zune is a great product, better than older iPods in many ways (especially for video).  But, I don't like the software as much as iTunes.  It's not as podcast friendly so I stick to using my iPod.  Oh - and it was SUPER cheap at the time off woot.com.

The HD-DVD player was also fine.  But I couldn't convince the rest of the world and they lost that battle.

And NEVER diss my Pontiac!  That car was awesome and even now I wish I still had it for warm summer drives.  Ran perfect, never a lick of trouble.  And never had so many compliments on a car.

So, while I don't have a crystal ball, I stand by my decisions when I made them and still do.

I actually have a pretty good track record at picking things that go on to great heights.  I had a VCR, a CD player, a DVD player, a DVR before most people.  I had a computer way before many.  I watched "Star Trek" back in the good old days (as did you Bryan).  But like Chris said above, success is nice, but that's VERY hard to pick and judge ahead of time.  Again, I stick to what I think will be good and useful.

To bring this back to the iPhone, I do think it's a very good product.  But, I am dissappointed by Apple's response to a known problem.  Heck, I probably would have one version of it if it worked with Sprint (and still might someday).  But, I want them to step up and fix it a bit more first.

[Feathers]

I'm one of those that use the thing as a computer first and a phone second but I keep the form factor for the sheer portability of it. Phone is important but it's not the primary use for my phone...er that sounds odd! ;)

[billybob476]

Oddly, I am the same way. I deifntiely make calls but if I compare my data usage versus my voice time usage, data is much higher. Surfing, twitter, facebook, skype (for long distance)...

I never really thought about it until now but I really do use it as a phone second.

[jedijeff]

Reading through the thread, regarding the issues with iPhone 4, if someone decided to return one due to the issues, are they still tied to their contract they signed with it, and would they be forced to possibly choose a different phone that they may not want? Just asking as not sure how Phone contracts work in the US. as I would think that would be a bit of a disappointment, if you were stuck to a contract and either using an old phone or one you did not want.

I would also think with all the press on the problems, that it would chase off perspective buyers until Apple fixes the phone. If it is a hardware issue and they fix it in new phones, do you think they might slightly rebrand it, so they can differentiate it from the current iPhone 4, so that people think they are getting something different?

I have a smart phone, to be honest, I use the data far more then I use the phone part. I don't have a large circle of friends, so I don't do a lot of texting, but even less talking on the phone, but that is probably just more the person I am, as I am not a phone talking person. I agree that the phone part in these devices should work as well as other phones from past and present, as there really should be no excuse given the years mobile phones have been around. But for me, I will admit, when I am deciding on a smart phone, the phone part is not one of the big considerations when deciding.