TREKS IN SCI-FI FORUM

Main Decks => Star Trek => Topic started by: Rico on April 17, 2007, 05:35:10 AM

Title: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Rico on April 17, 2007, 05:35:10 AM
Jeff emailed me and was asking about the alternate ending to the Star Trek: Generations film.  I grabbed the scene off my 2 disc DVD set and put it up on YouTube.  Basically it's an extended fight scene between Kirk and Soran.  Plus Kirk dies a bit differently.  I kind of prefer it over the movie version.  Let me know what you all think.

[youtube=425,350]KwQZWdzDwTo[/youtube]
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Geekyfanboy on April 17, 2007, 08:42:33 AM
I heard that when the tested the film, fans didn't like the way Kirk died.. they said it was a senseless death and that Kirk didn't get any final words. So they reworked it so Kirk has that big finale and reactivates the missile just in time and then has his final words to Picard.

I liked both endings, I think I like the one in the movie just because I've seen it so many times.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Movie Sean on April 17, 2007, 09:47:06 AM
I'd go with the move one myself.

I like how it caries on Kirk's idea of dying alone.  Well, more alone then in the alternate ending. 

It wouldnt' of killed me to see that version. 

Nice to see more Generations stuff, I always feel like it gets abused way too much. 

I liked it myself.  Though it was the first trek film I saw in the theatre when I considered myself a trek fan.  I had seen others, but I was going with my dad as a kid.  Sure the whales were cool, but who's that sulu guy?  :)
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Rico on April 17, 2007, 10:20:51 AM
I still ultimately think it would of been much better if Kirk hadn't died at all.  This could of brought him into the TNG time line and setup a lot of cool stuff.  Of course, Shatner does bring him back in his series of Kirk novels, most of which are pretty good.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: JoSpiv on April 17, 2007, 03:40:50 PM
It was very interesting.

And for me, really shows how important music and score is to a film.    It's really amazing.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Geekyfanboy on April 17, 2007, 03:42:55 PM
Quote from: JoSpiv on April 17, 2007, 03:40:50 PM
It was very interesting.

And for me, really shows how important music and score is to a film.    It's really amazing.

Yeah I thought the same thing... big difference
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Fanboy on April 17, 2007, 03:48:54 PM
I miss the KIRK!
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Jobydrone on April 17, 2007, 06:21:32 PM
Unfortunately no amount of post production editing can redeem the script.  All kidding aside, Spock's Brain not withstanding, Kirk's death is the single most disgraceful moment in Trek history.  To take one of the most iconic figures in popular culture and throw him off a bridge has got to go down as the worst idea ever.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Geekyfanboy on April 17, 2007, 06:26:18 PM
Quote from: Jobydrone4of20 on April 17, 2007, 06:21:32 PM
To take one of the most iconic figures in popular culture and throw him off a bridge has got to go down as the worst idea ever.

Do you prefer the alternate ending and Kirk getting shot in the back?
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: CocaCola1 on April 17, 2007, 06:27:46 PM
Something I thought that would've been different while Kirk was laying there near death was to have a montage of "classic" Kirk moments. Their are lots of them. The fights, the villains, the tribbles, AND the ladies. And then say his line, "It was fun." Yeah...It would've been a real tearjerker.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: metron07 on April 17, 2007, 07:14:25 PM
1. All that jet plane noise! Yes Score is SOOO important.
2. The movie ending is much better.
3. I agree they should have not killed off Kirk. I wonder if Shatter had anything to do with that writing decision?
4. I also agree having his life flash before his death would have been very emotional.

It's time someone had the idea to make an entire movie about Westley Crusher's travels through time and space and how he has an adventure that includes all the Trek greats including Kirk and brings him back. Will, please come and save us!
:2cents
PS My favorite line of the movie ending. "Oh My" :'(
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Poodyglitz on April 17, 2007, 07:55:14 PM
I thought Kirk and Picard were going to kiss for a moment.  ;D

Seriously, Kirk's death, if it had to happen, was a little better here. But Soren's was better in the movie. The fact that Picard and Kirk exchanged no words was a bit empty in this version. The fight scene between Soren and Kirk had no style in either version. There were better fight scenes in TOS. What I'll give George Lucas is his sensibility for crafting fight scenes.

I'll certainly agree that music plays a huge role. However, no amount of music, choreography or editing can clean up a horrible idea. Kirk still should not have died so. If he was to die, it should have been much more heroic, like doing a Kamikaze run into another ship or riding the missile in order to veer it off course. Heck, he could have even blown up the terminal with himself and Soren there.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Darkmolerman on April 17, 2007, 08:02:00 PM
lol i got tierd of 2 people beating eachother up....WHOA! what kind of kid am i....
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Poodyglitz on April 17, 2007, 08:04:47 PM
Quote from: Darkmolerman on April 17, 2007, 08:02:00 PM
lol i got tierd of 2 people beating eachother up....WHOA! what kind of kid am i....

One who appreciates a finely crafted, well choreograped fight scene, I would imagine. :-)
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: metron07 on April 17, 2007, 08:23:27 PM
All I can say after reading everyone's comments below again is.. I have another dream.

A dream where the people who make these films include a group of serious fans like us to help them make these script decisions.

Yes, I know, but how would it remain a secret before the movie opens?

My answer, make such a great movie that knowing the plot outline will never be better than seeing it. Remember Lord of the Rings anyone!!!

It may be time for such a movement in the 40+ year history of this franchise. More interaction with us from the movie makers and less of a passive roll by the fans.

In every revolution there are people with a vision.

I know, just a dream. But it's fun to think about.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Poodyglitz on April 18, 2007, 07:27:40 AM
Quote from: metron07 on April 17, 2007, 08:23:27 PM
All I can say after reading everyone's comments below again is.. I have another dream.

A dream where the people who make these films include a group of serious fans like us to help them make these script decisions.

Yes, I know, but how would it remain a secret before the movie opens?

My answer, make such a great movie that knowing the plot outline will never be better than seeing it. Remember Lord of the Rings anyone!!!

It may be time for such a movement in the 40+ year history of this franchise. More interaction with us from the movie makers and less of a passive roll by the fans.

In every revolution there are people with a vision.

I know, just a dream. But it's fun to think about.


Or, we as fans can band together and show CBS/Paramount how it's done. I truly believe that the revolution is just beginning. While there's a ways to go, some folks have made admirable contributions. One day, there will be a sci-fi (hopefully Star Trek) episode or movie that will give us all hope. I'd like to think that one day, I'll be able to take a stab at it.

Bottom line, it will take an enthusiastic team of folks who are determined to produce something of quality, along the lines of "Lord Of The Rings".
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Darkmolerman on April 19, 2007, 07:06:16 PM
Quote from: Poodyglitz on April 17, 2007, 08:04:47 PM
Quote from: Darkmolerman on April 17, 2007, 08:02:00 PM
lol i got tierd of 2 people beating eachother up....WHOA! what kind of kid am i....

One who appreciates a finely crafted, well choreograped fight scene, I would imagine. :-)
Yeah I like the Starwars ones, well i like fight scene with music and not grunts
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Jobydrone on April 19, 2007, 08:20:31 PM
Quote from: StarTrekFanatic5 on April 17, 2007, 06:26:18 PM
Do you prefer the alternate ending and Kirk getting shot in the back?

Is this a serious or sarcastic question?  I haven't watched the alternate ending since the extended DVD first came out so I can't really say, though that question like asking which you would prefer, a punch in the face or a kick in the balls.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Poodyglitz on April 19, 2007, 08:22:58 PM
Quote from: Jobydrone4of20 on April 19, 2007, 08:20:31 PMIs this a serious or sarcastic question?  I haven't watched the alternate ending since the extended DVD first came out so I can't really say, though that question like asking which you would prefer, a punch in the face or a kick in the balls.

Oh, no he di-int!
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Geekyfanboy on April 19, 2007, 11:07:38 PM
Quote from: Jobydrone4of20 on April 19, 2007, 08:20:31 PM
Quote from: StarTrekFanatic5 on April 17, 2007, 06:26:18 PM
Do you prefer the alternate ending and Kirk getting shot in the back?

Is this a serious or sarcastic question?  I haven't watched the alternate ending since the extended DVD first came out so I can't really say, though that question like asking which you would prefer, a punch in the face or a kick in the balls.

It's a serious question, I know people didn't like that they killed Kirk off but if you had to choice between the two endings which one would you choose?
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Poodyglitz on April 20, 2007, 07:08:16 AM
I say they should have done an homage to the end of "Dr. Strangelove..." and had Kirk ride the missile into the horizon -- to the strains of "There Will Never Be Another You". It would have set the same tone that the concept of The Nexus set.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: metron07 on April 20, 2007, 08:37:40 PM
If I had a say at the time the film was made, I say find a way to get him back to the Nexus instead of killing him. This way he still would have passed the command to the Next Gen films, but it would have made it easier at any time in the past or future to bring him back. Pity they did not decide on that. All I can hope is they do the same thing with Kirk they did with Guinean, that there is still a peace of him in the Nexus and someone finds it somewhere in the future or the past.

Sounds like, , , FUN!
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Movie Sean on April 21, 2007, 08:57:56 AM
I guess I am in the minority.

Kirk died the way he lived.

He was doing all he could to save people from those that would do harm to them.

Sounds like  a good death to me.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Darkmolerman on April 22, 2007, 05:06:04 PM
well for Kirk he would love to die like that, no ambushes
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Picard_delta_5 on April 24, 2007, 08:25:35 PM
I like the movie one so much better.... i agree with Sean... Kirk died the way he lived... "It was fun"

fun fact regarding George Lucas and all the comments about the great fight scenes of star wars... George Lucas didn't direct / choreograph the 2 great fight scenes (yoda vs emperor, obi vs anakin) in Revenge... Spielberg did... legal issues prevented Lucas from crediting him as a guest director...
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Poodyglitz on April 25, 2007, 01:17:18 PM
Quote from: Picard_delta_5 on April 24, 2007, 08:25:35 PMfun fact regarding George Lucas and all the comments about the great fight scenes of star wars... George Lucas didn't direct / choreograph the 2 great fight scenes (yoda vs emperor, obi vs anakin) in Revenge... Spielberg did... legal issues prevented Lucas from crediting him as a guest director...

Cool fact. I did not know that. Thanks.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Darth Gaos on April 25, 2007, 01:58:45 PM
I dunno I liked the movie version well enough.   I'm with Darkmolerman here...that alternate fight scene was WAY too long.  I really had no problem with Kirk dying or the way he died...it was a passing of the torch I guess.  I personally think a "Kirk's life montage" would have been horrible and VERY cliche.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Movie Sean on April 26, 2007, 10:18:33 PM
Yeah, unless it's on South Park the montage thing would have been horrible.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Jobydrone on April 27, 2007, 07:02:10 AM
As an interesting side note, I am reading the third book in the Crucible series of Star Trek TOS novels, and the concept behind this one is that Kirk, at the moment of his death on Veridian, is transported back to the Nexus to continue his adventures.  The catch, at least so far, is that he can't leave the Nexus because if he does the injuries he sustained during his fall would instantly kill him.  I haven't got much further than that yet, when I finish I'll send Rico a full review of the whole trilogy for the podcast.  The second novel, featuring Spock was quite good.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Movie Sean on April 27, 2007, 11:14:56 AM
I like how wide a berth Star Trek authors are given, they come up with some great stuff.
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Darkmolerman on April 29, 2007, 11:14:35 PM
Quote from: Darth Gaos on April 25, 2007, 01:58:45 PM
I dunno I liked the movie version well enough.   I'm with Darkmolerman here...that alternate fight scene was WAY too long.  I really had no problem with Kirk dying or the way he died...it was a passing of the torch I guess.  I personally think a "Kirk's life montage" would have been horrible and VERY cliche.

Yeah that was WAY to long and no music just uhh err murrphh.

Also about George not doing the best fights. All I need to say is "Well he did a good Darth Maul fight"
Title: Re: Alternate ending to ST: Generations - video
Post by: Picard_delta_5 on May 01, 2007, 09:21:47 PM
Quote from: Darkmolerman on April 29, 2007, 11:14:35 PM

Also about George not doing the best fights. All I need to say is "Well he did a good Darth Maul fight"

well that's debatable... I don't really want to get into that right now, but the Darth Maul scene could have been better...


Quote from: Movie Sean on April 27, 2007, 11:14:56 AM
I like how wide a berth Star Trek authors are given, they come up with some great stuff.

Exactly!!! Trip never died in the recent Enterprise Novels... I haven't actually read them but I did read an article about them in Trek Mag a while back... However, if I had to pick between senseless deaths, Trip would def top Kirk... (You know it's true guys... just think about it...)