Well, this has got me a bit bothered. The idea that Facebook is tracking and monitoring your activity even when logged off their site is just plain wrong. Heck, I don't even like it when I'm logged into Facebook. Anyway, read on and beware....
Facebook's use of software that enables it to track users' online activity after they log off of the social-networking site came under scrutiny in Washington this week, with lawmakers and consumer advocacy groups demanding a federal investigation.
In a letter to the Federal Trade Commission, Reps. Edward J. Markey (D-Mass.) and Joe Barton (R-Tex.) wrote that Facebook's use of "cookie" software should be investigated under the "unfair and deceptive acts" clause of the agency's mandate.
"When people log out of Facebook, they are under the expectation that Facebook is no longer monitoring their activities," wrote the congressmen, who chair the bipartisan Congressional Privacy Caucus. "We believe this impression should be the reality."
On Thursday, the Electronic Privacy Information Center and nine other consumer and privacy groups made a similar request, voicing concerns about whether the company's privacy policies cover new Facebook features that highlight user information on profiles and put real-time activity in the spotlight.
The FTC declined to comment on whether it plans to investigate. But the calls for action add to growing criticism of the world's largest social-networking site and the privacy policies that apply to its 800 million users worldwide.
The cookie-tracking issue was thrust into the spotlight when self-proclaimed Australian hacker Nik Cubrilovic looked into Facebook's code and discovered that the network was apparently tracking users' Web consumption after they logged off. He posted this discovery on his blog Sunday.
Cubrilovic said Facebook responded to his concerns, explaining that the company has cookies that persist after log-out to identify outside parties who try to access a user's account.
As furor built, the Facebook engineer who works on these systems issued a statement acknowledging that Facebook, like other Internet sites that personalize content, uses cookies. The engineer, Gregg Stefancik, said three of these cookies on some users' computers "included unique identifiers when the user had logged out of Facebook."
"However, we did not store these identifiers for logged-out users. Therefore, we could not have used this information for tracking or any other purpose," Stefancik said.
Facebook said the issue has been fixed so the cookies would not retain the identifiers. (The Washington Post Co.'s chairman and chief executive, Donald E. Graham, is a member of Facebook's board of directors.)
But the letter from EPIC, signed by the American Civil Liberties Union and Consumer Watchdog, raised further issues about Facebook's new "frictionless sharing" features, which allow applications to post user activity in real time, without requiring permission from account holders for each update. The apps require users to grant permission once to generate updates — when they add an app. Users have the ability to change these settings at any time.
Some apps are already using the new platform, flooding users' real-time feeds with information on what their friends are reading and listening to through the site.
The groups also raised concerns about the Facebook "Timeline," or revamped profile, which collects a user's information on Facebook into a scrapbook-like page, giving anyone who views the page an at-a-glance summary of a user's entire life.
"These changes in business practices give the company far greater ability to disclose the personal information of its users to its business partners than in the past," the groups wrote. "Options for users to preserve the privacy standards they have established have become confusing, impractical, and unfair."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/facebook-tracking-prompts-calls-for-ftc-investigation/2011/09/29/gIQAVdsP8K_story.html (http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/facebook-tracking-prompts-calls-for-ftc-investigation/2011/09/29/gIQAVdsP8K_story.html)
I noticed a new 'Share on facebook' button pop up on netflix for iPad, I summarily killed it. Unfortunately tracking of this type isn't new, Facebook's 'frictionless sharing' feature is however. While I'm all for sharing (as evidenced by my twitter/Facebook/G+/Foursquare/Instagram/etc feeds), I like to remain in control of it.
God knows we all end up at somewhat questionable sites or read somewhat questionable articles on occasion.
I think FB will get sued for this. This is a very big violation of privacy, especially when logged off. I'm honestly contemplating picking up shop and moving to Google+ entirely, over this...
King
Quote from: KingIsaacLinksr on September 30, 2011, 09:53:06 AM
I think FB will get sued for this. This is a very big violation of privacy, especially when logged off. I'm honestly contemplating picking up shop and moving to Google+ entirely, over this...
King
Sued for what? It's in the agreement you clicked on.
Quote from: X on September 30, 2011, 10:28:20 AM
Quote from: KingIsaacLinksr on September 30, 2011, 09:53:06 AM
I think FB will get sued for this. This is a very big violation of privacy, especially when logged off. I'm honestly contemplating picking up shop and moving to Google+ entirely, over this...
King
Sued for what? It's in the agreement you clicked on.
What agreement? If I signed one initially, it certainly didn't cover this. If by agreement you mean every time I sign in, sure. Fine. Except now we don't even sign out when we sign out so we can't even back out of the agreement.
King
Quote from: KingIsaacLinksr on September 30, 2011, 10:30:23 AM
Quote from: X on September 30, 2011, 10:28:20 AM
Quote from: KingIsaacLinksr on September 30, 2011, 09:53:06 AM
I think FB will get sued for this. This is a very big violation of privacy, especially when logged off. I'm honestly contemplating picking up shop and moving to Google+ entirely, over this...
King
Sued for what? It's in the agreement you clicked on.
What agreement? If I signed one initially, it certainly didn't cover this. If by agreement you mean every time I sign in, sure. Fine. Except now we don't even sign out when we sign out so we can't even back out of the agreement.
King
I'm confident they have amended the EULA to cover these new features.
Quote from: billybob476 on September 30, 2011, 10:40:06 AM
Quote from: KingIsaacLinksr on September 30, 2011, 10:30:23 AM
Quote from: X on September 30, 2011, 10:28:20 AM
Quote from: KingIsaacLinksr on September 30, 2011, 09:53:06 AM
I think FB will get sued for this. This is a very big violation of privacy, especially when logged off. I'm honestly contemplating picking up shop and moving to Google+ entirely, over this...
King
Sued for what? It's in the agreement you clicked on.
What agreement? If I signed one initially, it certainly didn't cover this. If by agreement you mean every time I sign in, sure. Fine. Except now we don't even sign out when we sign out so we can't even back out of the agreement.
King
I'm confident they have amended the EULA to cover these new features.
Usually I complain when companies change their EULA and force you to read the changes, but this is one of those times that I wish FB notified us of each and every change.
I'm keeping a very wary eye on FB right now. They feel like they have the power and authority to force any change they see fit, regardless of whether society is ready.
King
Interestingly I was reading an article about the outcry in 2006 when the news feed was first introduced. People were very uncomfortable with the fact their activities were being automatically posted to all their friend's feeds. Fast forward to today and we don't even give the news feed a second thought, it's probably the primary way people consume the site.
I'm not saying they are right in doing this, however we as a people are very uncomfortable with change. As with most things, this will blow over. If there are real privacy concerns, the user base will vote. Remember beacon? Maybe not, because it had activity on 3rtd party sites posting to FB without permission, it was killed. FB isn't the government, FB isn't god. If something doesn't work or infringes on our rights somehow, it will be stopped.
Quote from: billybob476 on September 30, 2011, 10:47:58 AM
Interestingly I was reading an article about the outcry in 2006 when the news feed was first introduced. People were very uncomfortable with the fact their activities were being automatically posted to all their friend's feeds. Fast forward to today and we don't even give the news feed a second thought, it's probably the primary way people consume the site.
I'm not saying they are right in doing this, however we as a people are very uncomfortable with change. As with most things, this will blow over. If there are real privacy concerns, the user base will vote. Remember beacon? Maybe not, because it had activity on 3rtd party sites posting to FB without permission, it was killed. FB isn't the government, FB isn't god. If something doesn't work or infringes on our rights somehow, it will be stopped.
Very well said. Look, billybob is right. We, as a people, are VERY uncomfortable with change, especially this type of change. I'm not going to debate if FaceBook is right, wrong, or what. Because I don't care. FB isn't a government, they're not a god (well, maybe to some!), NO ONE is under NO WAY obligated to use their services. In a Utopian society, this wouldn't be an issue, but trust me kiddies, the world we live in is so far from wonderful that the light from wonderful doesn't even register on the Hubble. That being said, if you "need" to be connected to others in this type of social environment, these are the things to live with. And let me tell you, if you think FB is the first or only company to track users without their knowledge, I think you need to wake up a bit. Even Uncle Sam does it to us. 24/7. My two cents...
Pff, I'm not saying FB is all that secure and not-tracking. (heck, what is the like button for anyway, if not to track what we like) And we'd all be kidding ourselves if we thought the ISPs and the government weren't tracking us. My issue is it sharing everything we do without our expressed permission. Granted, I never made that clear in my original post, but I take issue with it simply posting wherever we are and whatever we do without us clicking some sort of button. I do not share my life on the internet 100%. And if Mark Zuckerberg shares his life 100% on Facebook, I will eat all my shirts. But I know for a fact that he does not because that would involve talking about FB's practices. And we know those are behind closed doors.
That is what I take issue with. Also, logging out = logging out. If websites start ignoring that, its going to start issues we can't even begin to grasp.
King
Just to be clear re: "frictionless sharing"
You DO have to authorize any external apps the first time they attempt to connect to facebook, just never again after that.
Quote from: billybob476 on September 30, 2011, 12:06:30 PM
Just to be clear re: "frictionless sharing"
You DO have to authorize any external apps the first time they attempt to connect to facebook, just never again after that.
Ok, then that's fine.
King
Are Facebook actually trying to lose people or what? They have mad some very questionable decisions lately....
I made sure my linkis https:// nowadays, not sure if that makes a blind bit of difference.
If anyone decides to delete their Facebook account you should follow these instructions:
http://www.wikihow.com/Permanently-Delete-a-Facebook-Account (http://www.wikihow.com/Permanently-Delete-a-Facebook-Account)
Be aware that if you use any Facebook Connect accounts those also need to be closed and absolutely do not try logging into your account for at least two weeks. If you do your account will not be deleted.
Kevin
yeesh. i had a facebook account months back but then deleted it after hearing stories on how it does bad things.
this just seems creepy. knowing where people are all the time. could be useful for police though....
Well alright, I got nothing to hide. I don't do anything online that I would regret anyone knowing about. I mean I see why people wouldn't like this, and maybe they shouldn't do it. Though I've suspected it might be the case since I got the thing with the common ads I get related to pages I visit.
Provided these cookies don't slow my computer down, I'm fine too. I use it as an way to communicate in public with family and friends....and I always keep in mind that it is open for all to see.....and besides, my fetish sites aren't showing on my Facebook page. (Did I say that out loud!! lol)
The only thing that bothers me is Facebooks insistance that I shouldn't be able to see ALL friends postings in CHRONOLGICAL order. It keeps telling me that my cousins choice of sandwich for the day is an important story and forgets to tell me about friends graduation pictures being available to see.
The only way I've found of doing this is by making a new list called EVERYONE with all friends manually selected to be included on it. But then it doesn't show posting from groups I am in.
I guess two things bug me the most about all this. First, they don't make it obvious they are doing this and many won't even know it. The other thing is, I don't want to start getting a lot of junk email, maybe even junk mail related to my searches on the latest topic I'm looking up, etc. I wish everything was private by default and you actually had to turn features like this on. Kind of like Google + is doing. I know that's true with certain things about Facebook, but not everything. The whole thing just has too much of a "crazy stalker" feel to it for me.
Quote from: ori-STUDFARM on October 01, 2011, 04:41:20 AM
Provided these cookies don't slow my computer down, I'm fine too. I use it as an way to communicate in public with family and friends....and I always keep in mind that it is open for all to see.....and besides, my fetish sites aren't showing on my Facebook page. (Did I say that out loud!! lol)
The only thing that bothers me is Facebooks insistance that I shouldn't be able to see ALL friends postings in CHRONOLGICAL order. It keeps telling me that my cousins choice of sandwich for the day is an important story and forgets to tell me about friends graduation pictures being available to see.
The only way I've found of doing this is by making a new list called EVERYONE with all friends manually selected to be included on it. But then it doesn't show posting from groups I am in.
Yeah I spent like an hour trying to find a way to shut that new feature off. With no luck. I shrunk that box down as small as I could get it. And frankly I want my old chat box back with lists. I had a good system and now it's all screwed up.
Here's an easy solution for this. Delete all your cookies in the standard browser you normally use for Facebook. You can try and pick and choose the Facebook ones, but you may miss something. Then load up another browser you never use (maybe IE, maybe Opera, etc...). Then only log into Facebook in this "alternative browser." Use that browser for Facebook only - basically. Boom - problem solved! :)
You can actually set your browser to clear cookies every time you close it.
Quote from: billybob476 on October 03, 2011, 09:31:07 AM
You can actually set your browser to clear cookies every time you close it.
Yes, of course. But I don't want to remove all my cookies. Just the bad, nasty ones like Facebook! :)
Quote from: Rico on October 03, 2011, 12:25:38 PM
Quote from: billybob476 on October 03, 2011, 09:31:07 AM
You can actually set your browser to clear cookies every time you close it.
Yes, of course. But I don't want to remove all my cookies. Just the bad, nasty ones like Facebook! :)
...because chocolate chip is too good to filter ;)
More info on Facebook tracking your web activity...
The social networking site, whose profits come primarily from advertising, had been vague about its collection of tracking data. But it now acknowledges it can use cookies to create a 90-day log of where each of its members have gone on the Web after visiting a Facebook page, USA Today reports.....
Read more: http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2011/11/16/Facebook-tracking-raises-privacy-concerns/UPI-25921321458389/#ixzz1dt2c0OUq (http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2011/11/16/Facebook-tracking-raises-privacy-concerns/UPI-25921321458389/#ixzz1dt2c0OUq)
Lots of websites do this, they just don't get as much press as Facebook. Google actually pushes it on advertisers. You can drop cookies on someone's browser just for visiting a site - not even logging in - and have a record of where they go, what they search for, etc. Then serve them ads on related searches up to 6 months later. If you enter your name and address on one site that drops a cookie, and then continue to browse, these companies now have your information and a list of supposed interests that they can sell to telemarketing firms and direct mail lists.
I do a lot of paid search marketing and my Google reps have been pushing this on me for months, but I keep resisting setting up those content ads. They went so far as to create a campaign for me and try to talk me into enabling it. And I'm sure there are a lot of companies out there who are not resisting this type of "marketing." And, if Facebook is to be believed, their use of this information is a lot less creepy than these marketers. So, I would be much more concerned with regular advertisers having a log of your online activity than Facebook.
I agree, a lot of websites do this. But, that doesn't make it right. This is going to become even more of an issue as time goes on and more people learn just how unsecure and open things are when they go online unless you take precautions.
Looks like Facebook is in the news again about this subject:
http://news.businessweek.com/article.asp?documentKey=1376-LVG0I60YHQ0Y01-1GK6NCN9BEJPQPA4R5GP7JVGNN (http://news.businessweek.com/article.asp?documentKey=1376-LVG0I60YHQ0Y01-1GK6NCN9BEJPQPA4R5GP7JVGNN)
Yeah, read about this. Kinda same-old, same-old all over again as far as Facebook is concerned. =\
King