A friend of mine posted this on her facebook page. Its moving and breaks my heart that this happens in schools.
Words are worse than Sticks and Stones (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37_ncv79fLA#)
Brave girl for posting this, I hope her life gets better.
.....geez, she's not even in High School. And that's far worse than Junior High was for me.
I hope her circumstances change. Its a real tragedy what kids will do to others.
King
I think bullying has always been really bad, but now, because of social media, we see it more and it's getting worse. I don't think that anyone hasn't been through the pain of being bullied in some way, but as we grow older, many of us put those incidents behind us and forget how painful they were when they were happening.
I also don't see a way to stop it. Children can be these spiteful self absorbed selfish beings and as much as we try to teach them to be better, it doesn't always work. As a parent, I do my best everyday to teach my kids to not be bullies and that words are only words. The problem with that is that as logical as the solution might seem, children are these bouncing balls of emotion and logic doesn't help them deal with the pain of the words used against them.
I also think that social media is partly to blame for this. Sign on to any MMO or gaming site and you can see how children today have no real concept that there are other real people on the other end of their rants. They don't care either. They put themselves at the center of their own universes and have no problems lashing out at strangers, be they adults or children.
I think that we're slowly watching the social skills and respect of a entire generation atrophy under the weight of a world where they don't have to have personal face to face interaction with the people they attack and abuse. It's far easier to attack someone on the internet, over game chats, and on social media sites because your targets can't finally rise up and punch the bully in the face in the front of the school and take away their power.
I also think that too many parents have fun house mirror perceptions of their children. They don't see what their children are doing, so they don't look past the surface of the behavior that their children show. Everyone wants their kid to not be "that kid" and hope creates a certain blindness in parents that assist in this behavior continuing.
We need to stop this. We've always needed to stop this, but we really need to get together as parents to figure out how. We need to create the tools to stop this problem. It's never been the responsibility of the schools to do this, but we've placed it on their shoulders for far too long. Schools don't have the actual power to deal with this. Bullying doesn't start and stop during the hours of school. At best, they should only be used as an alert device to warn us of potential problem and when that bell is sounded, parents need to get away from the mentality of the bully being someone else's kid and teach their child.
I agree with what you said X. But until parents take responsibility, this will be a constant problem.
King
Schools need to adopt a ZERO Tolerance rule for bullying. And parents need to be held responsible.
Quote from: Geekyfanboy on March 30, 2011, 02:36:24 PM
Schools need to adopt a ZERO Tolerance rule for bullying. And parents need to be held responsible.
There is a no-tolerance rule for bullying at all schools as far as I'm aware. But the reason cases like her's exist is due to the simple fact that it is impossible to control people's actions at all hours of the day. Short of a prison that is. People can talk under their breath, yell it across the room, etc. Text messaging is another added problem. Papers put into backpacks when the teacher isn't looking. There is simply no way of destroying bullying without parent reinforcement. And the methods I just named are only a few of the ways bullying can happen.
People can be at both sides of the spectrum. I see no way of stopping it reasonably as things are. I wish there was...but simply put, friends, family and support can get kids through tough times.
King
there's been bully prevention programs at school lately. since they started the number of times i see it in the hallways has gone from 0 to 2 or 3 times a day (and way more if you count busses) i can't really thing of a reason why that is. shouldn't the bully prevention videos, talks, newsletters, etc. be lowering the number of cases instead of raising them? ??? i just don't get it.
Quote from: turtlesrock on March 30, 2011, 07:13:33 PM
there's been bully prevention programs at school lately. since they started the number of times i see it in the hallways has gone from 0 to 2 or 3 times a day (and way more if you count busses) i can't really thing of a reason why that is. shouldn't the bully prevention videos, talks, newsletters, etc. be lowering the number of cases instead of raising them? ??? i just don't get it.
If anti-drug/anti-smoking/anti-drink-while-driving messages worked in school, we would have an entire generation that did none of it. Current evidence says otherwise.
Not trying to be negative, I'm just saying, that's how it is, kids rebel against adults, kids want to try new things, they don't see smoking as a bad thing. Those bullies? Don't see what they are doing as wrong. For whatever reason that might be.
King
Quote from: Kingisaaclinksr on March 30, 2011, 02:33:54 PM
I agree with what you said X. But until parents take responsibility, this will be a constant problem.
King
x3, and although I am not a parent, I think another parental issue is that many want to be their kids best firend and not their parent.
Quote from: Geekyfanboy on March 30, 2011, 02:36:24 PM
Schools need to adopt a ZERO Tolerance rule for bullying. And parents need to be held responsible.
Speaking as someone quite familiar with both school policies and by having two kids, I can tell you a zero tolerance policy is in place in schools these days. Do they catch everything that happens - certainly not. Quite a bit happens on bus rides, walks to school, etc. All teachers and parents can do is try and keep their eyes open, talk to their students and kids and try to stop things before they get really bad. This is not an easy to thing to stop, but I will say it has on average gotten better over the years.
Quote from: Rico on March 31, 2011, 08:35:07 AM
This is not an easy to thing to stop, but I will say it has on average gotten better over the years.
Or has migrated online.
Quote from: Rico on March 31, 2011, 08:35:07 AM
Quote from: Geekyfanboy on March 30, 2011, 02:36:24 PM
Schools need to adopt a ZERO Tolerance rule for bullying. And parents need to be held responsible.
This is not an easy to thing to stop, but I will say it has on average gotten better over the years.
I have to disagree that it's gotten better.. like Bryan said there are so many more ways to bully now, via facebook, blogs, email, you tube and it seems like were hearing about kids killing themselves weekly because of bullying. I've seen numerous video of kids fighting or being picked on and teachers walking right by. I have experience it's personally being picked on and seeing teacher ignore the situation or if you do complain about it they tell you to toughen up and that they can't do anything about it unless they see it. So though school have a zero tolerance rule they do not enforce it.
Quote from: Geekyfanboy on March 31, 2011, 09:35:37 AM
I have to disagree that it's gotten better.. like Bryan said there are so many more ways to bully now, via facebook, blogs, email, you tube and it seems like were hearing about kids killing themselves weekly because of bullying. I've seen numerous video of kids fighting or being picked on and teachers walking right by. I have experience it's personally being picked on and seeing teacher ignore the situation or if you do complain about it they tell you to toughen up and that they can't do anything about it unless they see it. So though school have a zero tolerance rule they do not enforce it.
This also begs the question, which if memory serves we have discussed before regarding the suicides of gay teens, is bullying worse today or are we just hearing about it and being exposed to it more due to social media? What used to be done in relative anonymity is now on YouTube.
Quote from: Bryancd on March 31, 2011, 09:44:27 AM
Quote from: Geekyfanboy on March 31, 2011, 09:35:37 AM
I have to disagree that it's gotten better.. like Bryan said there are so many more ways to bully now, via facebook, blogs, email, you tube and it seems like were hearing about kids killing themselves weekly because of bullying. I've seen numerous video of kids fighting or being picked on and teachers walking right by. I have experience it's personally being picked on and seeing teacher ignore the situation or if you do complain about it they tell you to toughen up and that they can't do anything about it unless they see it. So though school have a zero tolerance rule they do not enforce it.
This also begs the question, which if memory serves we have discussed before regarding the suicides of gay teens, is bullying worse today or are we just hearing about it and being exposed to it more due to social media? What used to be done in relative anonymity is now on YouTube.
This is my opinion about the Mainstream news. Violence and the "horrors" of humanity I don't think is any worse than before, its just brought to focus because we can now absorb it from the internet or the TV which focuses heavily on it.
King
Quote from: Bryancd on March 31, 2011, 09:44:27 AM
Quote from: Geekyfanboy on March 31, 2011, 09:35:37 AM
I have to disagree that it's gotten better.. like Bryan said there are so many more ways to bully now, via facebook, blogs, email, you tube and it seems like were hearing about kids killing themselves weekly because of bullying. I've seen numerous video of kids fighting or being picked on and teachers walking right by. I have experience it's personally being picked on and seeing teacher ignore the situation or if you do complain about it they tell you to toughen up and that they can't do anything about it unless they see it. So though school have a zero tolerance rule they do not enforce it.
This also begs the question, which if memory serves we have discussed before regarding the suicides of gay teens, is bullying worse today or are we just hearing about it and being exposed to it more due to social media? What used to be done in relative anonymity is now on YouTube.
I don't think it's any worse but I don't think it's any better... I do think we hear about it more because the world is so connected now.
I think it has gotten worse and I think the reason is that there are so many self-centered parents that aren't involved with their children.
I was bullied a ton in grade school, that all changed when I hit a growth spurt and the bullies left me alone. I never had an inclination to bully, but that's because my parents raised me to be a tolerant, understanding and compassionate person.
If you don't know that your child is a big bully, it's your fault as a parent. The least you can do for the future is to teach your kids to be tolerant of others.
Duffster
Like I've always said.. kids are not born with hate in them.. it's taught.. from parents, friends, relatives... the people they are surrounded by.
Ok, I wasn't going to chime in on this topic because oft times when I do on these sensitive matters, I tend to put my foot in my mouth and offend someone. But, I do have something to say, plus I'm getting close to 1,000 posts and want to pad my numbers a bit :)
For those who know me personally or have seen photos of me, you'll probably think this is bunk, (I am fairly large, played football most of my life in school and semi-pro teams, was a bounty hunter for a couple of years and competed in the Scottish Highland Games - Heavy Athletics), but when I was young, I was bullied a LOT, not only by schoolmates, but both of my older brothers. I was a chubby kid and had a bit of a stuttering problem, so you can imagine my hazing was relentless. Now, mind you this was during the 1970's, so life was different then. I grew quite the horrible complex because of the bullying I was subjected to, and became very much an introvert, shy and not confident in myself at all. In fact, it was partially due to the ongoing bullying that I became the sci-fi nerd I am today!
As life went on, my father taught me that I could do something about this crap, and talked me into trying out for my Jr. High School football team. I was a natural it seemed. My dad encouraged me constantly but never really went after the kids bullying me or their parents, or even my brothers. But he did teach me that I could change things and not allow "them" to beat me down mentally. Eventually I grew out of my "baby fat" and grew into an athlete and the bullying stopped. But the "scars" never left me, and honestly, I'm glad they never did.
I hate bullies. Period. They obviously have issues of their own that they just cannot address, and the only way they can feel better about themselves is to make others miserable. We ALL encounter bullies of some sort in our lives. That just sucks but it is what it is. My situation, although very unpleasant, wasn't nearly as bad as some of these poor kids. Never once did I envision that ending my life would make things better. Never once did I envision that taking a gun and opening fire on others would make things better. But then, I had a father who showed me how to turn that CRAP into a fire that would help me make things better. I feel great empathy and sympathy for anyone who is bullied. I wish there were a way to stop it, but honestly, all we can do is offer counseling and a watchful eye. It doesn't matter how tough we make our school policies, as was stated somewhere here, there's only so much that can be done. Sure, we can eliminate bullying at school, but that won't stop the bullying everywhere else. Thanks to our terrific technical advances, we've opened the door to a whole new world of bullying - cyber bullying.
I agree that we need parents to get more involved with their kids and stop being spectators. I was lucky. My dad cared.
Sorry for the very long look into my past, and I'm sure many of you are looking for a refund on the last 10 minutes of you day! :) I just felt compelled to share. Sorry :)
When I said things are better, I was speaking strictly from a school standpoint. And I'm also speaking over a longer time period, compared to say 20+ years or more ago (not the last few years). Schools are much less tolerant these days, mainly due to legal issues. I hate to describe to you what things were like in Detroit during the 1960's. Of course, things vary from place to place - town to town. But always keep in mind it's a combined group effort and there is responsibility on everyone: schools, parents, and the kids themselves.
You're absolutely right Rico...
I got bullied a lot myself in middle school and junior high. The words weren't as much an issue. It was the actual getting pushed around and locked in lockers once or twice (it's really sucked being small for that reason). Funny thing about it is now all the people who bullied me are living really messed up lives and I'm way stronger and capable than I was then. They wouldn't dare try anything now or they are really, really stupid.
I do remember high school though. The first greeting I got many mornings when I arrive was the middle finger. I just ignored everybody who did that stuff and eventually they began to leave me alone. And I started surrounding myself with big footballer friends. High School for me was actually easier and one year on the wrestling team helped too make me more confident in defending myself.
I didn't get bullied as much, probably due to my brooding and tall stature. (me, brood? Nahhhh ;)) That isn't to say that it was all roses and fairies though. What kept me going is the knowledge that those same people would struggle to keep a McDonald job while I was doing bigger and better things. The bigger and better hasn't happened yet, but those same people are:
arrested/in jail
dealing with a bad marriage
totally broke
have kid(s)
etc
I don't think anyone avoided that. So, what goes around, comes around. And I'm stronger for it.
King
We also need to consider that as a species, we are likely genetically predisposed towards aggressive behavior towards others when we are young, growing, and under hormonal stress. It's easy to rationalize and intellectualize all of this as adults, but that reasoning is far beyond their ability in adolescence.
Quote from: Bryancd on March 31, 2011, 05:30:21 PM
We also need to consider that as a species, we are likely genetically predisposed towards aggressive behavior towards others when we are young, growing, and under hormonal stress. It's easy to rationalize and intellectualize all of this as adults, but that reasoning is far beyond their ability in adolescence.
Agreed. At it's most fundamental level, bullying appears to be establishing a pack pecking order. To avoid being at the bottom of the pack, humans, like animals, attempt to put someone else there. It doesn't make it right by any stretch of the imagination, but that's what we're facing. No one wants to be last and young minds tend to deal in absolutes in some of these cases. If they have it bad, they have it the worse and adults can't understand.
Sadly, we can't. We went through the fires, gained our scars, and most of us have healed a bit from them. As much as we'd like to say we know what these kids are going through, we don't. We are blessed that our minds protect us from that pain as time goes on. Sure, we can remember the bad times, but we'll never remember exactly how bad those times were. We're not built that way for the most part.
Most humans have the need to be accepted and the desire to run with the pack. Most of us don't want to be at the bottom of the social ladder. Some can be comfortable as the lone wolf, but everyone, in my experience, craves some sort of human contact.
Logically, we should be able to crush bullying because we have some understanding of the pain it causes, but at the ages involved, we are usually these raw masses of nerves and emotions. Logic has little place in the mind of growing children. They will push and push at the wall of society just to see what they can get away with.
It sucks, but we already knew that. I don't think that hate is even the driving factor of the bullies, I think it's the desire to not be last or to better yet, be first. It's the people that are first that get the accolades, the girls, and the thrill of victory. However, for someone to be first, other people have to be last. Sports and other competitions be it drama, or intellect competitions tend to quench some of these group desires, but when these various groups meet, none of them still want to sit at the bottom of the pecking order.
As I said before, I don't know how to fix this. The only way I survived was because I knew I was better than the people around me and they couldn't compete. Regardless if that was true or not, in my world, I was the alpha and everyone else was just trying to reach my position. That worked for me, but it doesn't work for everyone. It's like the only person that can take away the power of a bully is the person that is being bullied. The problem is that few kids think they they have that power. The pain runs too deep and they can't see beyond the darkness.
I just wish that we knew of a way to fix this because it's never going to change as long as humans have emotions.
How do you empower a victim that truly believes that they have no power?