A look at the film, "Prometheus" with guests Al & Bryan. They cover the movie and try and answer some of the many questions we all have about it. Like what's with all that weird black goo stuff?! Thanks guys!
http://www.treksinscifi.com/podcasts/TreksinSciFi_409_Prometheus.mp3 (http://www.treksinscifi.com/podcasts/TreksinSciFi_409_Prometheus.mp3)
Love the podcast. Here is what I thought about the crew:
[spoiler] Vickers put them together for the sole purpose of failing. She wanted the company and with that many hand picked screw ups on the crew, there was no way her father would get what he was looking for. Add to that the fact that she had a personal ship ready to go when they screwed up and I think that's why we got this dysfunctional crew in the first place. They were exactly what she wanted them to be.[/spoiler]
Quote from: X on November 04, 2012, 10:37:25 AM
Love the podcast. Here is what I thought about the crew:
[spoiler] Vickers put them together for the sole purpose of failing. She wanted the company and with that many hand picked screw ups on the crew, there was no way her father would get what he was looking for. Add to that the fact that she had a personal ship ready to go when they screwed up and I think that's why we got this dysfunctional crew in the first place. They were exactly what she wanted them to be.[/spoiler]
That's an interesting take, Chris, I like that and agree it works. Although we only got a glimpse of what her motivation was, perhaps it will be expanded in the sequel..assuming she is still alive...and a human. :)
Downloading it right now.
Man, I can't wait to listen it. :cheers
Great show guys. I'm definately going to check out the movie now. You've put forward some interesting ideas and I like the premise.
Thanks Dan! I myself just had a chance to listen to the show and it really came together great thanks to Al. I especially enjoyed the audio interview clips at the end.
Looking forward to this one.
Cool! I'm looking foward to listening to the podcast. I've already watched the movie 7 times and I discover something new each time, or rather, maybe questions answered.
Spoiler Alert!!!
I'm listening to the podcast now and here are a few of my comments:
To prequel, or not to prequel? - It's 'sort of' a prequel. I guess a better way of calling it is a "parallel prequel". I believe he wanted to create a parallel storyline that runs along the Alien storyline. So in a way, it IS linked to the Alien universe as we know it from the Alien franchise, but c'mon, the galaxy is a big place, there's got to be other Engineer events occurring that is linked to the alien development. That's why Prometheus takes place on a different planet from the original Alien. Think of the possibilities of what the movie is starting. What if EACH Engineer's research ship creates a different story arc in the galaxy?
Vickers: I didn't like her character either, but she was the token representative of the company values, ideals, and image. She is cut throat and wants to take over Weyland Industries. She's just waiting for Peter Weyland to die, probably because of the way he treats her. She wants his acceptance of her, and that's probably why she is on the Prometheus.
Fifield and Millburn: They're the token Dallas and Brett characters, they're only there for the money, and want to do as little as possible and still get paid.
Medpod: Everyone's pissed about why it wasn't for a woman especially when it was in Vicker's lifeboat. The key thing here to know is that the medpod isn't for everybody. It's there specifically for Weyland. So they probably customized it to just his physiology in the event that he is left alone with no one to help him. Heck, the lifeboat was probably created specifically just for him in case he needs to evacuate the ship.
Charlie: is a discovery junkie. He gets off on taking chances and proven right at discovering things. He wants to be the 'first' in trying everything. And I think this is why David infected him with the black goo cause he saw that Charlie had that personality trait who will probably be able to handle anything the goo will do to him. Like you said, he was a tool.
Life by accident? - I'm on the fence about the reason why the Engineer drank the black goo. Just as he drank the black goo, it shows the ship leaving. If it was an experiment, they would have stayed behind to observe what happens to him. But they just left. This looks like to me, "okay, we dropped you off, you drank the black goo, we're out of here. We'll come back in a few thousand years and see what the place looks like." Sounds more like a deliberate experiment.
My favorite characters were the flight crew. Janek, Chance, and Ravel. Trivia: Benedict Wong was in an episode of the british sitcom The IT Crowd as Prime-the proprietor of the club 8+. This is a must watch show for computer geeks.
Awesome podcast. Thanks guys!
Nice job, boys. Very though provoking and introspective. I am gonna have to send in a comment for Alien Resurrection, I let A3 slide but not that steaming pile.
Quote from: Coda on November 05, 2012, 12:20:20 PM
Fifield and Millburn: They're the token Dallas and Brett characters, they're only there for the money, and want to do as little as possible and still get paid.
You mean Parker and Brett. Yeah, that's a good parallel. I agree with your other observations as well. It certainly is possible the Engineer at the beginning was part of an experiment but I agree since the ship was leaving, I think they knew very well the outcome and have done this kind of terra forming before.
Quote from: Bryancd on November 05, 2012, 02:39:18 PM
Quote from: Coda on November 05, 2012, 12:20:20 PM
Fifield and Millburn: They're the token Dallas and Brett characters, they're only there for the money, and want to do as little as possible and still get paid.
You mean Parker and Brett. Yeah, that's a good parallel. I agree with your other observations as well. It certainly is possible the Engineer at the beginning was part of an experiment but I agree since the ship was leaving, I think they knew very well the outcome and have done this kind of terra forming before.
Parker and Brett, but not as good and done by actors who aren't as good. Parker and Brett WERE Alien fodder but weren't written obviously that way or acted that way. There's really no comparison in characterizations between Alien and Prometheus as far as secondaries go.
Another well done job guys. Much of what you had to say I agreed with for the most part. I still think the movie falls a little short in some key areas - like plot, character, etc. Frankly one of my biggest issues with the film you didn't mention much and that was how easy they figured out where to go out in space. Space is big and that little star pattern just wasn't enough for me. But I still am happy I saw the film in the theaters - it is an amazing looking movie. Looking forward to the sequel.
Quote from: Rico on November 05, 2012, 02:56:48 PM
Space is big and that little star pattern just wasn't enough for me. But I still am happy I saw the film in the theaters - it is an amazing looking movie. Looking forward to the sequel.
Yeah, kind of gave them that one. But you know there are actual cave painting of constellations and such and looking form Earth, considering that the observers who drew the paintings were primitive and not using any optical aid, it would likely be a very obvious pattern in the night sky. I suppose we can sort of assume that.
AWESOME Bryan and Al, almost forgot the yardwork while listening away on the iPod. You guys are a dynamic duo!
V
Quote from: Bryancd on November 05, 2012, 02:39:18 PM
Quote from: Coda on November 05, 2012, 12:20:20 PM
Fifield and Millburn: They're the token Dallas and Brett characters, they're only there for the money, and want to do as little as possible and still get paid.
You mean Parker and Brett. Yeah, that's a good parallel. I agree with your other observations as well. It certainly is possible the Engineer at the beginning was part of an experiment but I agree since the ship was leaving, I think they knew very well the outcome and have done this kind of terra forming before.
Oh, right! Parker and Brett.
There's also the possibility the ship could have been automated too, since it didn't look like the derelict spacecraft and it looked like it turned on it's end and headed straight up. It almost looked like the ships from Independence Day.
Quote from: Rico on November 05, 2012, 02:56:48 PM
Another well done job guys. Much of what you had to say I agreed with for the most part. I still think the movie falls a little short in some key areas - like plot, character, etc. Frankly one of my biggest issues with the film you didn't mention much and that was how easy they figured out where to go out in space. Space is big and that little star pattern just wasn't enough for me. But I still am happy I saw the film in the theaters - it is an amazing looking movie. Looking forward to the sequel.
That's almost like when Dr. Daniel Jackson figured out the 7th symbol to activate the Stargate.... I think the fact that the ancient humans were able to see the star pattern, it meant the stars were viewable with the naked eye. And if they extrapolated from the locations of all of the other civilizations that also see he from their geographical location, I'm sure they can figure out where the planet is. They also had already known that there was a planet and moons there in the star system. So they must have some type of technology (Charlie mentioned long range scans) to be able to see that far away and even get data as to the moon being able to sustain life without actually going there first.
I have to also mention that I was a bit disappointed with Noomi Rapace's acting in this one. I saw her in all three of the Swedish versions of the Millenium series (Girl with the dragon tatoo, etc..), and she was really good in them.
And don't hate me for this, but all the characters were annoying and deserved their fate. All but the flight crew and David.... There was a depth to David's character that keeps you wondering what was going on in that AI head of his. It made his character unpredictable because of his own agenda.
Just had another thought. When Charlie asked David about him wearing a space suit, David's response was "I was designed like this...because YOU people are more comfortable interating with your own kind." This is a clear delineation of what he is compared to a human. It almost sounds like he resents the fact that he is clearly better than a human, but humans don't treat him as such. Remember when Weyland said that David was the closest thing to a son he would ever have? David's face lit up, until Weyland said that David didn't have a soul, so he can never be human. It's almost like, they made him human, but he can never be human nor treated as such. Deep stuff.
I agree with Rico, it was a beautiful movie, and I don't get tired of watching it over and over again. And I really like the way the Prometheus looks.
Hey guys, that green crystal thing Charlie was looking at looks like a bigger version of the same thing David took the drop of ooze from.
Thank you Al and Bryan for another great podcast. Listening the two of you has made me want to see the movie again. Thank you.
Quote from: Coda on November 05, 2012, 10:40:21 PM
Hey guys, that green crystal thing Charlie was looking at looks like a bigger version of the same thing David took the drop of ooze from.
Yeah, I still wonder if that had any significance. It had a very alter feel to it directly in front of the relief on the wall of the xenomorph, which itself was in a position like on a crucifix.
Thanks for a cool podcast Bryan and Al, now I want to see this movie!
I liked your insights to the characters and how they fit in to the franchise.
That was such a great podcast you guys. LOVED listening tonight as I moved equipment around my studio. I need to watch the movie again. Thanks for all your hard work Bryan and Al. VERY GOOD!
Gents, really enjoying the cast. The 'Real Trailer' at the start cracked me up.
Cool podcast, dudes; well done. :) As much as the movie frustrates me, I have to admit it has its redeeming qualities.
Quote from: moyer777 on November 07, 2012, 09:04:15 PM
That was such a great podcast you guys. LOVED listening tonight as I moved equipment around my studio. I need to watch the movie again. Thanks for all your hard work Bryan and Al. VERY GOOD!
Ah, Bryan did all the heavy lifting on this...so hat tip to Bryan!
Fantastic episode guys, really enjoyed this one. I thought i put a comment in as soon as i listened, obviously not. Great discussions about the story and the flaws. Thumbs Up.
Thanks guys! And thank you Al, without you it's just me talking to myself like a mental patient!
"Like" a mental patient???
http://www.prometheus-movie.com/uploads/112142280-Alien-Engineers.pdf (http://www.prometheus-movie.com/uploads/112142280-Alien-Engineers.pdf)
The first draft of the script for Prometheus when it was called Alien:Engineers, by a guy named Jon Spaihts.
Some points:
* The bulk of the movie takes place on LV-426 -- the same planet the Nostromo from "Alien" visited.
* Spaihts' Engineers are described as 15 feet tall. It takes two humans to lift a massive Engineer head.
* Noomi Rapace's role is named Jocelyn Watts instead of Elizabeth Shaw. Charlie Holloway is named Martin Holloway in this draft.
* David the android introduces Noomi and Holloway to the living Peter Weyland on a space station in Earth's orbit. There is no holographic Weyland near the start of the movie.
* The name of the ship is Magellan, not Prometheus.
* The business with David shooting basketball on a bicycle is absent. Ditto David dying his hair and watching "Lawrence of Arabia."
* The scene where the crewmen greet the alien cobra like a lost puppy is absent.
* The big storm is in this draft, but no flamethrower.
* A chestburster kills Holloway in its escape from his torso.
* Halfway through the movie, we learn a Weyland security force has been hidden on the Magellen the whole time.
* Weyland himself is not inexplicably hidden aboard the Magellen.
* Noomi's crucifix is not in this draft.
* If the Charlize Theron character randomly bones the Idris Elba character, I didn't notice that either.
* There's a deadly, acid-filled giant centipede. And an "octopoid" facehugger different from the one with which we're familiar. It turns out these Engineers carried at least seven kinds of weaponized species.
* Noomi becomes impregnated with an alien when an angry David places a facehugger on her. There's still a big medical pod C-section scene.
* I didn't notice anything about Holloway inspecting a tiny alien lodged in his eyeball.
* The alien craft still rolls toward Noomi on its edge.
* There's less of an Engineer rampage near the end.
* The movie ends with David and Noomi playing chess as beacons signal their masters. David and Noomi do not use an Engineer ship to escape the planet.
Quote from: Chris-El on November 13, 2012, 02:35:26 PM
http://www.prometheus-movie.com/uploads/112142280-Alien-Engineers.pdf (http://www.prometheus-movie.com/uploads/112142280-Alien-Engineers.pdf)
The first draft of the script for Prometheus when it was called Alien:Engineers, by a guy named Jon Spaihts.
Some points:
* The bulk of the movie takes place on LV-426 -- the same planet the Nostromo from "Alien" visited.
* Spaihts' Engineers are described as 15 feet tall. It takes two humans to lift a massive Engineer head.
* Noomi Rapace's role is named Jocelyn Watts instead of Elizabeth Shaw. Charlie Holloway is named Martin Holloway in this draft.
* David the android introduces Noomi and Holloway to the living Peter Weyland on a space station in Earth's orbit. There is no holographic Weyland near the start of the movie.
* The name of the ship is Magellan, not Prometheus.
* The business with David shooting basketball on a bicycle is absent. Ditto David dying his hair and watching "Lawrence of Arabia."
* The scene where the crewmen greet the alien cobra like a lost puppy is absent.
* The big storm is in this draft, but no flamethrower.
* A chestburster kills Holloway in its escape from his torso.
* Halfway through the movie, we learn a Weyland security force has been hidden on the Magellen the whole time.
* Weyland himself is not inexplicably hidden aboard the Magellen.
* Noomi's crucifix is not in this draft.
* If the Charlize Theron character randomly bones the Idris Elba character, I didn't notice that either.
* There's a deadly, acid-filled giant centipede. And an "octopoid" facehugger different from the one with which we're familiar. It turns out these Engineers carried at least seven kinds of weaponized species.
* Noomi becomes impregnated with an alien when an angry David places a facehugger on her. There's still a big medical pod C-section scene.
* I didn't notice anything about Holloway inspecting a tiny alien lodged in his eyeball.
* The alien craft still rolls toward Noomi on its edge.
* There's less of an Engineer rampage near the end.
* The movie ends with David and Noomi playing chess as beacons signal their masters. David and Noomi do not use an Engineer ship to escape the planet.
That was the movie I was hoping for, and it's the movie I could see peeking through the "lindelization" of the script. Sometimes, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" is incredibly appropriate.
I don't like this script better. I think the version we got works better for me because they didn't paint themselves in a corner and leave no survivors. For the movie to work, someone needs to survive.
Also, and here is what I think. There is nothing stopping part 3 from ending at the beginning of Alien.
What if that's the last ship to go after earth and it's sabotaged by a certain human survivor?
I can't remember, but wasn't there a distress signal that they picked up to bring them to the planet?
Yeah, the Nostromo received what it thought was a distress signal, which turned out to be a warning.
I'm glad I watched Prometheus. The film did a lot of the things that a good sci-fi film should do: It took me to another place and time, it entertained me, and it made me do a lot of thinking. If the film were released in a vacuum, I'd have a lot fewer issues with it.
As it stands, there are just too many of the original story elements evident in the movie. There are way too many coincidences. The Prometheus finds a planet that just happens to bear a striking similarity to the one discovered by the Nostromo. The Engineer's ship just happens to crash, winding up in the same position as the wreck found by the Nostromo.
I can overlook the plot holes and inconsistent characters in the movie, but the original script elements peaking through the final draft are a source of frustration for me.
I don't know if I would say that LV-233 bears any strong resemblance to LV-426 beyond being rocky and barren of life. They certainly present in the films as having very different atmospheres and surface conditions and since this film takes place not too long before the events of ALIEN, it seems unlikely the climate would alter that much. I didn't notice that the Engineer's ship came to rest in a similar position as the derelict found in ALIEN and certainly the ALIEN ship didn't have any noticeable damage from a collision with the Prometheus and falling to the ground.
Wasn't there a big hole ripped in the side that they entered from in Alien?
Mostly in this draft I think Halloway comes off better, he was maybe the worst characterization in the movie. He's a biologist fascinated by interstellar life, and when he finds it, he whines. My wife is a biologist and when she's involved with anything in her field, she's rapt.
Quote from: Chris-El on November 14, 2012, 12:35:05 PM
Wasn't there a big hole ripped in the side that they entered from in Alien?
No,silly, they just climbed into the big vagina. :)
Here are the deleted scene's we discussed.
http://blastr.com/2012/09/gorge-yourself-silly-on-1.php (http://blastr.com/2012/09/gorge-yourself-silly-on-1.php)
Oh, I forgot about the spaceship's genital entrance. OK. You got me.
I listen to the podcast a few days ago. great podcast guys. I haven't seen the movie yet but after listen to the commentary on the movie, I would easily understand what the plot is about. it was also great to hear that a movie of that gene did very well at the box office.
Got this one in kinda late but you guys do a very good job of covering this movie. You had a lot of interesting thoughts on the movie and to be honest it seemed like it was kinda confusing. Saying that I haven't seen this and I was never a huge fan of the Alien series so this wasn't on my must see list. You guys did peak my interest and I may catch this with a rental.